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-   -   Mastering files with automated tempo changes? (https://www.propellerheads.se/forum/showthread.php?t=174842)

cuttercreative 2013-01-21 04:13

Mastering files with automated tempo changes?
 
I'm working on a song in which I hope to use automated tempo shifts -- a slower intro that will jump up by 30 bpm when the main song starts.

The drums will be created using RDK, and I will be recording live instruments (guitar, bass, vocals) onto that.

I will be mixing the whole thing in Reason and applying compression, reverb and delay in the mix. Then, I will be exporting the track as an AIFF and re-importing the audio file into a new project for mastering. This is my usual workflow.

However, I've never tried this with a song where the tempo changes.

I know the tempo of the new project in which I'm mastering has to match the tempo of the song as it was exported -- so if I create a new mastering project for a song exported at 200 bpm, the mastering project should also be at 200 bpm.

I assume that, for a song with tempo changes, I can simply copy those tempo change automations into the new mastering project, so the mastering project tempo will match that of the source file, even with the changes. No problem there.

My question is this: Will that wreak havoc with any reverb and delay that is happening at the point where the tempo shifts? What about the live instrument tracks themselves? Will I get an audible time-strech effect?

Has anyone out there tried this sort of thing?

I'm going to make a test recording later this week and see how it works, but I wanted to throw this question out there. I don't want to get too far into this song only to discover that the tempo change will be a deal-breaker.

Thanks for any help/advice/suggestions...

platzangst 2013-01-21 04:47

I guess the question is: after you export the first project file to AIFF, is there anything in your mastering setup that requires tempo synchronization?

Because, if you do try to vary the tempo in your mastering project, you will have to make sure you "disable stretch" on that imported audio clip to avoid the tempo changes causing time-stretching. In fact, you may want to disable stretch anyway, regardless.

But, if all the tempo-based effects (such as delay/echo) are contained in the first project, they will be fixed in place with the audio export. Then, assuming your mastering setup is mostly for things like dynamics, EQ, loudness levels and such-like, tempo is irrelevant, and you probably don't need to automate them at all in the mastering project. If you've disabled the stretch on your imported audio clip, you could master the project at the default 120 BPM for all it matters.

Djsam 2013-01-21 06:39

are you sure dat can be possible..?

LABONERECORDINGS 2013-01-21 09:50

Maybe another possible solutions to the delays etc....

Write the track at the original 30bpm slower throughout. Export the mixdown so all tempo based delays etc are 'printed' into the audio.

When you reimport, you can then change your tempo settings after, on the large WAV / AIFF file, so then the speed will increase, the time based delays will coincide with the timestretch / compressing so you wont get the 'zipper' noises etc.

That's what we would do - try both versions (all at 1 set BPM throughout and one with your speedup section included in the initial mixdown)

ETalk 2013-01-21 14:50

I'd be interested to see the results of what works the best here as I'll be undertaking a similar job soon.

Matt

JensenTNI 2013-01-21 15:09

Actually I think that if you apply low-frequency EQing and multiband compressing, then the tempo does actually matter. As personal a rule of thump, the low-frequency limiting and EQ'ing should go up in freuency the faster the song plays because otherwise if you use steeper or narrower bands, the tempo will move your target frequency out of your processed band. Ofcourse I'm usually talking about smallish effects, but its something to consider regardless.

platzangst 2013-01-21 18:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by JensenTNI (Post 1223534)
Actually I think that if you apply low-frequency EQing and multiband compressing, then the tempo does actually matter. As personal a rule of thump, the low-frequency limiting and EQ'ing should go up in freuency the faster the song plays because otherwise if you use steeper or narrower bands, the tempo will move your target frequency out of your processed band. Ofcourse I'm usually talking about smallish effects, but its something to consider regardless.

You're talking about speeding up both time and pitch in that case, though. The time-stretching in Reason's audio tracks that is going on here shouldn't affect the frequencies.

If you were simply speeding up the playback of an audio track, like you would in one of the samplers, or in a Wave editor, that might be a concern, but it shouldn't be a factor in the situation the OP describes.

PsyTale 2013-01-21 18:10

What i did with masters of eden (in my signature) is just record the tempo change after. Thisway you can record your instruments in one tempo. Reason doesnt make it sound bad when you do this. I would use the highest tempo as your base, unless if its crazyhigh like 175+.

selig 2013-01-21 18:26

The only thing that comes to mind here is that you must "Disable Stretch" on all audio tracks you import for mastering because they will likely have embedded tempo data if exported from Reason - this will cause them to play back at the wrong tempo, unless it just happens to match the tempo of your mastering song file. :-)


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