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-   -   How to pitch shift to specific amounts? (https://www.propellerheads.se/forum/showthread.php?t=178957)

vanKloot 2013-03-24 03:29

How to pitch shift to specific amounts?
 
I've got a project where I'd like to pitch shift AND time compress some audio files by 134%. This is of course dead simple in a program like Audacity, but I was wondering if I could do this all within Reason. Unfortunately the Transpose function goes up only 1 octave (100%) so unless I want to transpose, bounce, then transpose again... I can't use that. Time stretching by dragging the clip on the timeline won't work because I can't get it exactly to what I want in terms of the % of change. Tried Neptune to get me the additional 34% on top of a transpose, but it sounded pretty awful. I don't want to load it into a sampler in order to pitch bend...

I don't have Polar but it looks like it might be able to handle the pitch part in real time, and I can get the speed just by changing the tempo.

Any other suggestions?

kloeckno 2013-03-24 03:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanKloot (Post 1270644)
Unfortunately the Transpose function goes up only 1 octave (100%) so unless I want to transpose, bounce, then transpose again...

That would be 200%, a 134% increase would be a little more than a third of an octave up

vanKloot 2013-03-24 04:12

Sorry, I'm talking 134% ABOVE the current location, so a total of 234% in absolute terms. I should've clarified.

platzangst 2013-03-24 07:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanKloot (Post 1270644)
I've got a project where I'd like to pitch shift AND time compress some audio files by 134%. This is of course dead simple in a program like Audacity, but I was wondering if I could do this all within Reason.

I guess in an Occam's Razor sort of way, I'm curious: If you can do it with the precision you need in Audacity, why wouldn't you just go ahead and do that and import the results? If doing it entirely in Reason requires complicated or inaccurate workarounds, then I'm not sure what the benefit is.

What's more, if you're changing pitch and tempo at the same rate - effectively just playing the audio faster or slower - I'd think loading the audio into a sampler would be exactly the best option inside Reason, if achieving the goal with minimum fuss is your aim. If you need to do further work with audio clips of the shifted audio, you could just bounce the sampler track to audio and work with that.

Wyggy 2013-03-24 09:56

Dont forget that the pitch parameter is not linear. It is exponential.

see:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piano_key_frequencies

vanKloot 2013-03-24 16:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wyggy (Post 1270744)
Dont forget that the pitch parameter is not linear. It is exponential.

see:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piano_key_frequencies

Good point, thanks for that. Since Reason doesn't have a % option for transposition, I just went with the same % change that audacity report to use.

My actual application here is recording 78rpm records at 33.33 rpm and then speeding them up to correct pitch/speed. Audacity does this perfectly fine, this was mostly an exercise in "I wonder if I can do this directly in Reason?" Basically looking to increase my Reason skills & knowledge by trying something I wouldn't normally do in it, to stretch my thinking.

Appreciate any further suggestions or insights into this! :)

Wyggy 2013-03-24 18:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanKloot (Post 1270987)
Good point, thanks for that. Since Reason doesn't have a % option for transposition, I just went with the same % change that audacity report to use.

My actual application here is recording 78rpm records at 33.33 rpm and then speeding them up to correct pitch/speed. Audacity does this perfectly fine, this was mostly an exercise in "I wonder if I can do this directly in Reason?" Basically looking to increase my Reason skills & knowledge by trying something I wouldn't normally do in it, to stretch my thinking.

Appreciate any further suggestions or insights into this! :)

I can't find a way of doing this. Obviously, you have used the stretch function to correct for tempo (speed). The pitch has to be increased in the same proportion but the pitch ruler is notched at semitone intervals and you can't move between the notches (snap action sort of). You could approximate. If the ruler were notched at cent intervals you could do it.

I think my thinking is right but I can't think as straight as I used to. I regret to say it is about the inverse of 200%. :)

platzangst 2013-03-24 19:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanKloot (Post 1270987)
My actual application here is recording 78rpm records at 33.33 rpm and then speeding them up to correct pitch/speed. Audacity does this perfectly fine, this was mostly an exercise in "I wonder if I can do this directly in Reason?" Basically looking to increase my Reason skills & knowledge by trying something I wouldn't normally do in it, to stretch my thinking.

It's worth pointing out that what Audacity is probably doing is simply speeding up or slowing down playback (and then resampling the result) in order to get the pitch and time adjusted. But that doesn't work like that in the Audio Tracks in Reason. Pitch shifting (or time stretching) by itself is a somewhat more complex operation, as it has to be able to adjust one parameter without affecting the other.

I'd love it if Reason could introduce a simple playback-rate setting to its audio clips, but I'm the only one I know of who ever asked for it in the Feature Suggestions forum. (Will Reason 7 have it? I dunno. Not holding my breath.)

The point is, you're introducing quite a bit more processing of the original audio, leading to more potential deviation from the original signal (and if you're recording 78 rpm records at 33, you're already hip-deep in signal deviation).

For fidelity's sake then, your best option would be to use a sampler, which would just slow down or speed up the audio playback. The problem is, you'd have to somehow calculate the exact ratio from the 33 and 78 speeds and turn those into semitones (and probably do some fine-tuning in cents) to find the exact settings to achieve your speed change. But once you had that, it would simply be a matter of plugging in the same settings for each audio file you wanted to convert.

Wyggy 2013-03-24 20:57

Audacity (Cool-edit of old) is flexible and gives the option of re-sampling (neither pitch nor tempo preserved), pitch without tempo change, tempo change maintaining pitch. Now! That would be a welcome feature in Reason 7. :)

reasoner498 2013-03-25 04:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wyggy (Post 1271234)
Audacity (Cool-edit of old) is flexible and gives the option of re-sampling (neither pitch nor tempo preserved), pitch without tempo change, tempo change maintaining pitch. Now! That would be a welcome feature in Reason 7. :)

Audacity is an open source audio editor.

Adobe Audition = the new Cool Edit Pro.

Fwiw, Reaper has fairly flexible pitch shifting built in...

Quote:

Originally Posted by http://www.reaper.fm/technical.php
ReaPitch Multivoice pitch shifting and pitch correction, with an unlimited number of individual shifters.

ReaTune Powerful automatic or manual pitch correction, with intuitive graphical interface, MIDI note output, and histogram for technical instrument tuning tasks.

ReaVoice MIDI-controlled multivoice pitch shifter.

ReaPitch, ReaTune, and ReaVoice can be driven by any of REAPER's included pitch shifting engines, including Elastique 2 Pro.



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