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-   -   Spectrum EQ is WEAK - beef it up please! (https://www.propellerheads.se/forum/showthread.php?t=182766)

tilsonic 2013-05-11 05:21

Spectrum EQ is WEAK - beef it up please!
 
I was really excited about the Spectrum EQ feature when I bought the 7.0 upgrade -- how great it would be to not have to stack 2 or more MClass EQs on one another to do EQing! Instead I can do it all on the channel strip!

But wait, the Spectrum EQ points have a limited frequency range you can place them in, you can only have a limited number of these points, and their Q values only go up to 2.5? This sort of thing is all or nothing IMO -- you either give me a full featured EQ that works at LEAST as well as the MClass, so I can switch most of my EQing over to it, or you've given me a weak piece of junk that's practically worthless to me.

Here's 3 things the Spectrum EQ needs to be truly useful to me:

1) Q Settings on low and hi shelves, like the MClass
2) Option to add more freq points than the default number
3) Q values higher than 2.5. A LOT higher! The MClass goes up to Q=32, and yes I DO need that precision sometimes!

That would do it I think. I love your software, but I'm frankly confused as to why things like this are kept so basic throughout all these revisions. You've created a KILLER mixer, now please enable me to truly MIX with it! I doubt you guys have a backroom deal with Waves or something ("listen up Propellerheads, keep your EQs crippled so we can maintain our market share!") So please, unchain the poor Spectrum EQ.

Thanks!

dub08 2013-05-11 05:55

You should really complain to Solid State logic as the Reason SSL mixer is modeled after their board. :p

I use mClass in the inserts of a track in question. Get surgical EARLY ON. Stack 3 Mclass eq if you want/need to.
Then, when tracks are ready to really "mix", I use SSL (spectrum eq) as a more gentle and general EQ. Quick LPF/HPF, quick "zones" for low, low mid, hi mid, hi.

People like that its modeled from the 9000k. IDK.. If they changed it, they probably couldn't claim that as the inspiration for their emulation.

colcifer 2013-05-11 06:19

I can't tell: do you like or not like the mixer? The spectrum eq is the same channel strip eq you had before... with a spectrum analyzer integrated. You can use the spectrum analyzer in tandem with mclass eqs in the rack, if you like.

rVOLT 2013-05-11 06:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by colcifer (Post 1313166)
I can't tell: do you like or not like the mixer? The spectrum eq is the same channel strip eq you had before... with a spectrum analyzer integrated. You can use the spectrum analyzer in tandem with mclass eqs in the rack, if you like.

Exactly......

nickmorgan19457 2013-05-11 07:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by tilsonic (Post 1313137)
now please enable me to truly MIX with it

People have been using an eq with these exact controls and limitations to produce some of the greatest albums of the last 30 years.
These kinds of posts are annoying as hell.

raymondh 2013-05-11 12:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by dub08 (Post 1313153)
You should really complain to Solid State logic as the Reason SSL mixer is modeled after their board. :p

I use mClass in the inserts of a track in question. Get surgical EARLY ON. Stack 3 Mclass eq if you want/need to.
Then, when tracks are ready to really "mix", I use SSL (spectrum eq) as a more gentle and general EQ. Quick LPF/HPF, quick "zones" for low, low mid, hi mid, hi.

People like that its modeled from the 9000k. IDK.. If they changed it, they probably couldn't claim that as the inspiration for their emulation.

good advice!

tilsonic 2013-05-11 16:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by dub08 (Post 1313153)
People like that its modeled from the 9000k. IDK.. If they changed it, they probably couldn't claim that as the inspiration for their emulation.

Yeah, just after posting I "got" the fact that the Spectrum just provides an interface for the channel strip EQ. That's clever and looks good on paper, but my problem with it is that the interface and convenience of the Spectrum EQ is so great that I wish it could do more. The MClass itself is kind of spartan and deserves an upgrade anyway, as long as we're adding fancy echo units and whatnot. Before upgrading from Record, I would never use the board EQ functions aside from hi/low cuts, because by the time I reached the mixer my sounds were so thoroughly sculpted it was superfluous. Now it'd be nice if the Spectrum could take over those functions. Also note I am currently mixing a rock EP, which doesn't really merit multiple stages of scultpting as electronic stuff does, hence why having ONE really strong EQ would be awesome.

I can think of 2 possible routes for improvement, in light of the SEQ's relation to the board:

1) Create an "Advanced Mode" option where the SEQ becomes more powerful, and the channel strip knobs are greyed out or covered up as they no longer directly relate to the SEQ. Tricky part here would be getting the aesthetics right, but the advantage is the F2-for-EQ shortcut would still work and that is fantastic.
2) Create a more advanced rack EQ with spectral analysis functions and all the features I described in the OP. In addition, an option to toggle the spectral view between pre- and post-EQ would be handy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nickmorgan19457 (Post 1313192)
People have been using an eq with these exact controls and limitations to produce some of the greatest albums of the last 30 years.
These kinds of posts are annoying as hell.

I find posts like that every bit as amusing as you find mine annoying. Computers now exist and we are no longer limited by physical constraints. Certainly I agree "it's not the tools you use," but as long as we're creating a totally amazing kick-ass DAW why limit ourselves to what's possible with hardware? I'm sure a lot of the wizened old heads who mixed so many of those brilliant records you're talking about would happily acknowledge that their jobs would've been a LOT easier if they'd had a tool that functioned on the order of a now-state-of-the-art EQ.

JohannEmmanuel 2013-05-11 17:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by tilsonic (Post 1313466)
Yeah, just after posting I "got" the fact that the Spectrum just provides an interface for the channel strip EQ. That's clever and looks good on paper, but my problem with it is that the interface and convenience of the Spectrum EQ is so great that I wish it could do more. The MClass itself is kind of spartan and deserves an upgrade anyway, as long as we're adding fancy echo units and whatnot. Before upgrading from Record, I would never use the board EQ functions aside from hi/low cuts, because by the time I reached the mixer my sounds were so thoroughly sculpted it was superfluous. Now it'd be nice if the Spectrum could take over those functions. Also note I am currently mixing a rock EP, which doesn't really merit multiple stages of scultpting as electronic stuff does, hence why having ONE really strong EQ would be awesome.

I can think of 2 possible routes for improvement, in light of the SEQ's relation to the board:

1) Create an "Advanced Mode" option where the SEQ becomes more powerful, and the channel strip knobs are greyed out or covered up as they no longer directly relate to the SEQ. Tricky part here would be getting the aesthetics right, but the advantage is the F2-for-EQ shortcut would still work and that is fantastic.
2) Create a more advanced rack EQ with spectral analysis functions and all the features I described in the OP. In addition, an option to toggle the spectral view between pre- and post-EQ would be handy.


I find posts like that every bit as amusing as you find mine annoying. Computers now exist and we are no longer limited by physical constraints. Certainly I agree "it's not the tools you use," but as long as we're creating a totally amazing kick-ass DAW why limit ourselves to what's possible with hardware? I'm sure a lot of the wizened old heads who mixed so many of those brilliant records you're talking about would happily acknowledge that their jobs would've been a LOT easier if they'd had a tool that functioned on the order of a now-state-of-the-art EQ.

Looking at the fft doesn't make mixing any easier, you should be able to listen,assess and then balance the track accordingly depending on the source material, not look at a scope and then just cut stuff because it looks "busy" lol

Nothing against your suggestion about having the mclass suite updated.

tilsonic 2013-05-11 17:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohannEmmanuel (Post 1313473)
Looking at the fft doesn't make mixing any easier, you should be able to listen,assess and then balance the track accordingly depending on the source material, not look at a scope and then just cut stuff because it looks "busy" lol

Nothing against your suggestion about having the mclass suite updated.

I completely agree; what I like about the SEQ that prompted this post is mainly the ability to move points around and adjust the Q without taking my hand off the mouse. And the F2 key shortcut is brilliant. Ideally the spectral analysis of a full featured MClass upgrade could be turned off, as it can indeed be distracting.

JohannEmmanuel 2013-05-11 17:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by tilsonic (Post 1313477)
I completely agree; what I like about the SEQ that prompted this post is mainly the ability to move points around and adjust the Q without taking my hand off the mouse. And the F2 key shortcut is brilliant. Ideally the spectral analysis of a full featured MClass upgrade could be turned off, as it can indeed be distracting.

Yes pressing f2 is cool, you can still use the mclass eq and look at the change on the fft screen anway :)You just cant move and drag the points like you can when you enable the channel strip eq sections.


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