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Old 2003-05-14, 05:40
stormchild's Avatar
stormchild stormchild is offline
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 14
Feature Suggestion: Spider MIDI Splitter

It has occured to me that it would be tremendously useful to have a device in Reason that accepts MIDI input and sends it to multiple devices. Unlike the other Spider devices, it should be possible to make a sequencer track for the MIDI Splitter, so you can record onto that track and have the recorded MIDI play back to multiple devices -- something that is currently impossible to do in Reason.

Although it is currently possible to control several devices at once via the MIDI input buses, there is no way to *record* yourself playing multiple devices. Only one of the targeted devices can be recorded at once. The MIDI Splitter would make it possible to control -- and RECORD yourself controlling -- multiple devices at once. Here are some of the possibilities of this device:

Playing the same chord on an electric piano and two different synths at the same time makes for a huge sound. Stacks were common in the 80s.

--Control Separate FX--
Play a sound on one device while controlling an effect device that it's connected to. For example, use a Scream 4 as a wah-wah effect on an NN-XT (as a user was trying to do; see the Scream 4 thread below).

--Control Multiple Knobs With One Physical Knob--
Suppose whenever you turn up the filter on your synth, you get a harsh ringing that you want to only notch out as the filter goes up. You could have a Parametric EQ connected that is set to notch out that frequency, with its gain set to zero. As you turn up the filter on the synth, the gain on the EQ decreases to compensate.

--Easy Editing--
You're recording to a single sequencer track that targets the MIDI Splitter. When you make changes to that track, you don't have to copy the changes to several different tracks -- it automatically updates for all devices.

--Daisy Chaining--
A MIDI Splitter's output could easily connect to the input of another MIDI Splitter, if you need more outputs than the Splitter provides. Of course if the Splitter has 16 outputs, that should be way more than enough. But even then, you could still daisy chain them, if you wanted to get silly.

--No Need To Sacrifice MIDI Input Buses--
Instead of using multiple MIDI input buses as a workaround, the buses remain free to be used by other input devices.

--Stacks & FX, etc. For Multiple Inputs--
Other input buses could also target MIDI Splitters, giving *each input bus* control over as many devices as you want.

MIDI Splitter Controls...

The MIDI Splitter would probably need to be a little more complex than the basic CV & Audio splitters. You might not want the modwheel output going to every connected device, for example. Maybe you want the note events to go to devices 1, 2 and 3, while modwheel and footpedal events would only go to device 4. It should be possible, with some kind of editing interface on the MIDI Splitter, to specify which events go to which output ports.

Additionally, I think it would be necessary to be able to adjust the scaling of each event type, per-output-port of the Splitter. If you want to slightly decrease the gain of the A frequency on a Parametric EQ while moving the filter cutoff of a synth up, with the same control, then you'd need some kind of bipolar knob (exactly like the CV input knobs on any device) to control the direction and scaling of the output of that event, for each port.

MIDI Cables...

Finally -- how are we going to connect the MIDI Splitter to the other devices? Well, the devices would need MIDI input jacks, and the MIDI Splitter would have MIDI output jacks, and therefore the cables connecting them would be MIDI cables!
Old 2003-05-14, 06:09
RykThekreator RykThekreator is offline
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 0
It was heavily recommended by many, last year. N/T

Old 2003-05-14, 23:04
stormchild's Avatar
stormchild stormchild is offline
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 14
Yes, but...

I don't recall there being any mention of this idea that was drawn out to the level of detail I provided.

It's not important whether the idea is new or original. I feel that I have presented a very strong case and good design for this idea.
Old 2003-05-14, 10:33
DIGITUS's Avatar
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 1,519
Me likes that idea very much.... :) n/t

Old 2003-05-14, 10:44
SamiRaj SamiRaj is offline
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Yeah i have suggested that to! Very cool! n/t

n/t = no text
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Old 2003-05-14, 12:42
jessekrebs jessekrebs is offline
Join Date: Mar 2002
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Re: Feature Suggestion: Spider MIDI Splitter

Yeah, this is actually what I thought the CV Spider was going to do (no reason - it was just an assumption I made). I was really looking forward to being able to control multiple devices simultaneously for layered sounds. Aside from the bus trick, I gather there's still no way to do this, which is too bad.

I'm not complaining, though! I still can't believe that 2.5 was a free update...
Old 2003-05-14, 18:40
killrks killrks is offline
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 0
Easy trick for splitting MIDI

I don't know how well this will work for what you want to do, but here's what I do to control more than one midi-controlled Reason device at a time:

Plug in your MIDI controller (I use an Oxygen 8)
Choose your controller in the MIDI prefs
In the Advanced MIDI prefs, choose your controller on all four busses

On the Hardware Interface at the top of your rack:
Hit the bus A button
On channel 1, pick a Malstrom synth
Hit the bus B button
On channel 1, pick a Subtractor synth
Hit the buc C button
On channel 1, pick an NN-XT
Hit the bus D button
On channel 1, pick a Redrum machine

Now, when you play your MIDI controller, the signal will be sent to all four devices simutainously.

Old 2003-05-14, 23:03
stormchild's Avatar
stormchild stormchild is offline
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 14
I mentioned that; the MIDI Splitter would do *way* more [nt]

Old 2003-05-15, 01:29
CephaloPod CephaloPod is offline
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 137
Re: Easy trick for splitting MIDI

Yeah, that works, but it sucks because you can't record all 4 parts, you have to cut and paste. It's very limited.

The props know all too well that this is a feature that we want. During Beta testing for R2.0, it was one of the most requested features and there was quite a lengthy discussion on it.

For some Reason, the props are reluctant to do it. Personally, I think they have left it out because they think that everyone will layer EVERYTHING at the expense of processor power. But I think most machines, especially most PCs (the Macs need to catch up), are now fast enough to handle it. It would make life a LOT simpler.
Old 2003-05-15, 18:07
Ogggy's Avatar
Ogggy Ogggy is offline
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 262
Re: Easy trick for splitting MIDI

1) Even though values within Reason are based on the 0-127 MIDI standard, there is an obvious reluctance to take MIDI any farther-they chose cv emulation. If they did this, MIDI out is so close, and they've put their foot down there. Maybe it's like the streaming deal-everyone wants "just a little" streaming-which begats the spiral quickly leading to the full-blown deal.

2) Have they ever changed a pre-existing device to implement a new feature? (yes-ReMix) What about backwards compatibility? You are asking for a change in every device.

Now that we have the cv splitter, not having access to cv values from the sequencer is pretty glaring. A single jack on the cv splitter pointing at any sequencer track would solve 2/3'rds of stormchild's issues, but pointed at exactly what in that track? hmmm. If it could point at note values OR any controller lane, then more of stormchild's issues are addressed, but that's a lot more complexity. Some could only be done with MIDI "cables". A whole new system to implement how much more control?

Good thread. I think we should try to take these "future suggestions" to the next level and really think about these ideas and discuss them and keep the Prop's recources in mind and not just post a ton of wishes.

So how about it? The real issue (ok, 90% stormchild?) is a new kind of access to what's in the sequencer, something way beyond what any other program does. I think the Spiders already give us something no other program can do! Groundbreaking Props.


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