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  #1  
Old 2012-08-12, 20:04
BoddAH's Avatar
BoddAH BoddAH is offline
 
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Question Lack of professional endorsement

I don't mean to troll or start a flame war or anything. I'm genuinely curious why Reason seems to have relatively low professional endorsement compared to most other big DAWs despite being one of the most popular ones.

Historically, Pro Tools, Cubase, Logic and the like have pretty much always been industry standard and that probably isn't going to change anytime soon so it is quite normal that the software is used in most studios by sound engineers everywhere.

But even as a creative tool, Reason seems to be overshadowed by Ableton by quite a lot and every big/successful contemporary DJ seems to be using it:

http://www.ableton.com/pages/artists/list

I know Reason can count some artists as well, some of them are even somewhat famous but it quite frankly pales in comparison with the list above containing some, if not all, of the most successful DJs and acts of today.

There's no arguing that Reason is a lot of fun to use and the software is probably just as powerful as any other DAW. You can definitely make great music with it but still I can't help but feel that many professionals dismiss Reason in favor of the competition.

So what do you think is the reason behind this?
  • Maybe it's the fact that Reason only recently became a fully fledged DAW and still likes to preserve some of its self contained nature, restricting freedom by design.
  • Maybe some producers still insist that there is, in fact, a "Reason sound".
  • Maybe Ableton actively seeks endorsements as part of their marketing and Propellerhead simply don't care.
  • Maybe the workflow, while certainly fun, is considered to be clunky and gimmicky by professional producers.
  • Do you even know of an incredibly famous and popular DJ/artist/act/producer that uses Reason as his main DAW?
Do you think professionals still see Reason as a toy and don't take it seriously? If so, why?

Last edited by BoddAH; 2012-08-12 at 20:19.
  #2  
Old 2012-08-12, 20:12
Exowildebeest Exowildebeest is online now
 
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Probably because 1) Ableton really IS very popular and 2) Propellerheads probably have a marketing strategy that doesn't involve looking for endorsements from high profile artists.
  #3  
Old 2012-08-12, 20:35
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Why does it need endorsing, if you already have one of the most popular DAWS on the market?
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  #4  
Old 2012-08-12, 20:40
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BoddAH BoddAH is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scifunk View Post
Why does it need endorsing, if you already have one of the most popular DAWS on the market?
It's popular by number of sales/users, not by professional users/platinum discs. The single most popular DAW is FL Studio. That doesn't mean that FL Studio is the best DAW ever made.
  #5  
Old 2012-08-12, 20:41
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We do have the artist stories, don't we? Which are in fact much more detailed than any name dropping somewhere else.

Professionals may also have needs that are not fulfilled in Reason yet. Ableton's matrix thingie is also somewhat still a unique way of matching clips and sequences (yea, I do know about Bitwig :P). Blocks was a nice attempt but is also too limited to compare to that.

If Reason adds and changes it may appeal to more beginners, but established people won't jump on it and exchange years of workflow.
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  #6  
Old 2012-08-12, 21:00
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I appreciate the "why" question. The blatantly cynical answer is why bother, or why does it matter or why not,
Some of it might be image control.
i.e. the more expensive and technically complex, not to mention expensive= exclusivity,.... conspicuous consumption=$$$$$$$.$$ snob appeal, my kit the more double-plus good my public image.

You don't need a Haute couture silk t-shirt costing $750.00 or an Astin Martin DB5, a TVR Sagaris, to drive across town, it's about image how one is perceived, in every day speak "THE BLING-FACTOR".
At one point a particular group from WARP label stable, made is clearly known that they were using N.I. products exclusively on their albums, putting them well in front of the curve at that time "virtual sophistiqué, chic, merveilleux, complete with an ART FORUM style band logo rather than the cutting edge street wall art style logos that were popular at the time.
IMAGE
Reason is affordable,available comparatively very easy to use compared to LOGIC or PRO TOOLS.
Reason has democratized the processes that people at MIlls College Center for Contemporary Music,
L'Ircam (Institut de Recherche et Coordination Acoustique/Musique) were only dreaming about being able to do twenty years ago and you can load it on your lap top and take it with you, where is the exclusivity and snob appeal in that?

I focus on the tools that I use from the perspective of how well does it work.
Not who is using it, how much buzz the reviewers are clucking about the bells and whistles. How well does this tool function in relationship to my getting the job done.

EXAMPLE:
Photoshop ( the incredible) is amazing , all I get when using it is options anxiety, Photoshop Elements allows me to a do all tHat I want to do quickly, easily and reliably, and i very pleased with the interface, and the price is about 75% cheaper than it's big sister.
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Last edited by duaneanderson; 2012-08-12 at 21:03.
  #7  
Old 2012-08-12, 21:02
nhsh nhsh is offline
 
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I swear some of these folks are professional full-time endorsers. I'll fire off a few emails and get them to endorse this post.
  #8  
Old 2012-08-12, 21:09
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The big question that comes to mind is, why is "professional endorsement" so important for you?
  #9  
Old 2012-08-12, 21:32
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BoddAH BoddAH is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danfarmer View Post
The big question that comes to mind is, why is "professional endorsement" so important for you?
Quote:
Originally Posted by duaneanderson View Post
I appreciate the "why" question. The blatantly cynical answer is why bother, or why does it matter or why not,
Some of it might be image control.
i.e. the more expensive and technically complex, not to mention expensive= exclusivity,.... conspicuous consumption=$$$$$$$.$$ snob appeal, my kit the more double-plus good my public image.

You don't need a Haute couture silk t-shirt costing $750.00 or an Astin Martin DB5, a TVR Sagaris, to drive across town, it's about image how one is perceived, in every day speak "THE BLING-FACTOR".
At one point a particular group from WARP label stable, made is clearly known that they were using N.I. products exclusively on their albums, putting them well in front of the curve at that time "virtual sophistiqué, chic, merveilleux, complete with an ART FORUM style band logo rather than the cutting edge street wall art style logos that were popular at the time.
IMAGE
Reason is affordable,available comparatively very easy to use compared to LOGIC or PRO TOOLS.
Reason has democratized the processes that people at MIlls College Center for Contemporary Music,
L'Ircam (Institut de Recherche et Coordination Acoustique/Musique) were only dreaming about being able to do twenty years ago and you can load it on your lap top and take it with you, where is the exclusivity and snob appeal in that?

I focus on the tools that I use from the perspective of how well does it work.
Not who is using it, how much buzz the reviewers are clucking about the bells and whistles. How well does this tool function in relationship to my getting the job done.

EXAMPLE:
Photoshop ( the incredible) is amazing , all I get when using it is options anxiety, Photoshop Elements allows me to a do all tHat I want to do quickly, easily and reliably, and i very pleased with the interface, and the price is about 75% cheaper than it's big sister.
I'm not the kind of guy who will run to the nearest shop and buy a pair of Beats by Dr Dre just because they're endorsed by big names everywhere. The primary deciding factor for anything I buy (an do for that matter) are always tangible facts.

But still, I don't believe in coincidences. And complex, intangible things like workflow or "creative freedom" if that makes any sense can't be measured with numbers. It could be a coincidence that some artists use a DAW rather than another. It could be a coincidence that Daft Punk, Nine Inch Nails, and many more use Ableton Live rather than Reason. But I find it hard to believe that almost every single famous/popular/successful producer/DJ out there uses other DAWs and nobody uses Reason. Taste is subjective obviously but that doesn't change the fact that many of these are iconic, long-lived acts that can easily be considered to be a part of music history.

Yet, at the same time, nobody can name a single successful act whose main DAW is Reason. That's no coincidence.

I don't consider myself musically uncultured but while the Reason Artist Stories are certainly entertaining to read, the fact is that I never heard of most of them. Of the dozens of acts listed I know only 5:

Stromae, Owl City, Hank Shocklee, Beastie Boys and Richard Barbieri. 2 of them are "one hit wonders" that most people already forgot and the other 3 are revenants from the misty past of music history that likely came back from the dead for a nice little endorsement paycheck (I'm being a bit cynical here).

I'm just naturally curious and I'd really like to know just why professionals don't seem to use Reason. And why so few people using Reason as a main DAW ever become successful. I love and use Reason exclusively and I *think* I know that it's a perfectly capable professional tool but the facts seem to prove me wrong.

Last edited by BoddAH; 2012-08-12 at 21:38.
  #10  
Old 2012-08-12, 21:39
Mate Mate is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BoddAH View Post
I'm not the kind of guy who will run to the nearest shop and buy a pair of Beats by Dr Dre just because they're endorsed by big names everywhere. The primary deciding factor for anything I buy (an do for that matter) are always tangible facts.

But still, I don't believe in coincidences. It could be a coincidence that some artists use a DAW rather than another. It could be a coincidence that Daft Punk, Nine Inch Nails, and many more use Ableton Live rather than Reason. But I find it hard to believe that almost every single famous/popular/successful producer/DJ out there uses other DAWs and nobody uses Reason. Taste is subjective obviously but that doesn't change the fact that many of these are iconic, long-lived acts that can easily be considered to be a part of music history.

Yet, at the same time, nobody can name a single successful act whose main DAW is Reason. That's no coincidence.

I don't consider myself musically uncultured but while the Reason Artist Stories are certainly entertaining to read, the fact is that I never heard of most of them. Of the dozens of acts listed I know only 5:

Stromae, Owl City, Hank Shocklee, Beastie Boys and Richard Barbieri. 2 of them are "one hit wonders" that most people already forgot and the other 3 are revenants from the misty past of music history that likely came back from the dead for a nice little endorsement paycheck (I'm being a bit cynical here).

I'm just naturally curious and I'd really like to know just why professionals don't seem to use Reason. And why so few people using Reason as a main DAW ever become successful. I love and use Reason exclusively and I *think* I know that it's a perfectly capable professional tool but the facts seem to prove me wrong.
You just need to know one simple thing bro, could you become successful with Reason? And believe me, only you're able to answer this question for yourself!

Cheers!
 

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