Propellerhead Software
  #81  
Old 2012-11-07, 21:36
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KevWestBeats KevWestBeats is offline
 
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Originally Posted by rogerlevy View Post
Dream on cousin dream on. But in 3 years if they do improve the VST enough for Reason to be able to somehow work with them, old ones that I like will be incompatible, and I'm not going to be like THANK YOU sinnerfire for demanding VST's all these years - they finally listened! Everyone would be like ... huh. That's cool ... I guess. Because by then we'd have thousands of RE's to choose from.
In what ways are RE better than VST besides that RE are totally intergrated into Reason? If we take Reason out of the equation RE can't keep up. I love the format and Reason but to say that RE which is less than a year old is keeping up with a mature format like vst is just crazy.
  #82  
Old 2012-11-07, 22:11
rogerlevy rogerlevy is offline
 
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Originally Posted by KevWestBeats View Post
In what ways are RE better than VST besides that RE are totally intergrated into Reason? If we take Reason out of the equation RE can't keep up. I love the format and Reason but to say that RE which is less than a year old is keeping up with a mature format like vst is just crazy.
"If we take Reason out of the equation RE can't keep up" isn't a valid argument. It doesn't even make sense - RE's *are* Reason. However, this quote from a post I made in this thread contains lots of great arguments in favor of RE's imho:

Quote:
Each VST has its own different way of doing presets, undo, copy/pasting stuff, mouse controls, knobs, init... kinda annoying! Also, sometimes a DAW can not work very well with a VST that you like, like not having a 32bit/64bit bridge. (Cough, Ableton, Cough.) That's fun! Gotta start a 3rd party program to get around it and cross your fingers... eh.

And you can't use an instrument as an effect, devs have to make separate ones for that... Lots of old VST's use weird hacks to do sidechain...

And they don't even have CV on the back
Besides... I don't get what VST's have that RE's don't, that is actually necessary to making music. Once Props adds fancy graphics support of some kind, then we'll get spectral analyzers and all your fancy eye candy. What will VST's have then, besides their ubiquity, and their annoying install and registration procedures?

Last edited by rogerlevy; 2012-11-07 at 22:15.
  #83  
Old 2012-11-07, 22:48
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KevWestBeats KevWestBeats is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rogerlevy View Post
"If we take Reason out of the equation RE can't keep up" isn't a valid argument. It doesn't even make sense - RE's *are* Reason. However, this quote from a post I made in this thread contains lots of great arguments in favor of RE's imho:



Besides... I don't get what VST's have that RE's don't, that is actually necessary to making music. Once Props adds fancy graphics support of some kind, then we'll get spectral analyzers and all your fancy eye candy. What will VST's have then, besides their ubiquity, and their annoying install and registration procedures?
I think its very valid you take the DAW out of the equation and go plug in vs plug in. Vst plug ins can do things that RE cannot do or do not do yet. Like sampling for example a lot of vsts can sample or can do very large sample libraries RE cannot do this yet if all you want are synths and fx RE is great I really like the format but its not anywhere near mature as vst is yet. RE is just not there yet that's fact. There are reasons why some things have been removed from ported vsts like some of the fx stuff in Predator not much but a couple to make it work. FXpansion cannot do a lot of their vsts in RE format because the SDK does not allow for it. Plug ins like Diva, Maul, Kontakt, Tremor and Addictive Drums cannot be done in RE yet because it is just not ready. This is why the vst format is still better because RE is not there yet. I used to feel that way about Reason vs vst too I get how you feel and in many cases for most people's needs it is true you can get everything done in Reason but often times because of Reason's own limitations it is harder and slower to do a lot of the time. I am excited to see this format mature but my honest opinion is its not there yet unless you like having a ton of fx.
  #84  
Old 2012-11-07, 23:00
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KevWestBeats View Post
In what ways are RE better than VST besides that RE are totally intergrated into Reason? If we take Reason out of the equation RE can't keep up. I love the format and Reason but to say that RE which is less than a year old is keeping up with a mature format like vst is just crazy.
+1 I totally agree!!
  #85  
Old 2012-11-07, 23:07
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Originally Posted by rogerlevy View Post
Dream on cousin dream on. But in 3 years if they do improve the VST enough for Reason to be able to somehow work with them, old ones that I like will be incompatible, and I'm not going to be like THANK YOU sinnerfire for demanding VST's all these years - they finally listened! Everyone would be like ... huh. That's cool ... I guess. Because by then we'd have thousands of RE's to choose from.
You probably wont thank me in person.....but you know you will be thinking it.

See you in three years
  #86  
Old 2012-11-07, 23:42
rogerlevy rogerlevy is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KevWestBeats View Post
I think its very valid you take the DAW out of the equation and go plug in vs plug in. Vst plug ins can do things that RE cannot do or do not do yet. Like sampling for example a lot of vsts can sample or can do very large sample libraries RE cannot do this yet if all you want are synths and fx RE is great I really like the format but its not anywhere near mature as vst is yet. RE is just not there yet that's fact. There are reasons why some things have been removed from ported vsts like some of the fx stuff in Predator not much but a couple to make it work. FXpansion cannot do a lot of their vsts in RE format because the SDK does not allow for it. Plug ins like Diva, Maul, Kontakt, Tremor and Addictive Drums cannot be done in RE yet because it is just not ready. This is why the vst format is still better because RE is not there yet. I used to feel that way about Reason vs vst too I get how you feel and in many cases for most people's needs it is true you can get everything done in Reason but often times because of Reason's own limitations it is harder and slower to do a lot of the time. I am excited to see this format mature but my honest opinion is its not there yet unless you like having a ton of fx.
I guess you brought up some things I hadn't learned about VST's yet.

Well, time will tell about RE tech. I think I'm OK with RE being behind for the time being, it's new. And I'm new to plugins anyway so I don't mind starting with the basics along with it. So I guess that's why I don't care as much. But again, we'll see what happens.
  #87  
Old 2012-11-07, 23:57
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KevWestBeats KevWestBeats is offline
 
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Originally Posted by rogerlevy View Post
I guess you brought up some things I hadn't learned about VST's yet.

Well, time will tell about RE tech. I think I'm OK with RE being behind for the time being, it's new. And I'm new to plugins anyway so I don't mind starting with the basics along with it. So I guess that's why I don't care as much. But again, we'll see what happens.
I assumed as much. If you go check out some vsts that are out there you will at times be amazed at the limitations that Reason and the RE format does to you. I felt the same way you do years ago and I had only dealt with a lot of early vsts at the time outside of seeing a couple newer ones here and there that weren't all that impressive for me. Now that I have gone all the way in and use both I see a ton of stuff in vst that I like and others that I do not. One thing for sure though is I am glad that the format is a lot more stable now than it was in 2004 when I was using them regularly before saying screw these unstable things. I came back to vst a year ago and many of them are just as stable as Reason.
 

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